86. Question Boldly, Dr. Paul Byrne and Organ Harvesting
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Dr. Paul Byrne: [00:00:00] There's no way you can get a heart for transplant unless this is what happens to the donor. The donor has to be killed. It has to be murdered cuz it's not legal and yet it's accepted to be done. And certainly unpaired vital organs like the heart of the whole liver. There's no way to get those organs unless they get them from a living person.

Nurse Kelly: Welcome to after Hours with Dr. Sigoloff where he can share ideas and thoughts with you. He gets to the heart of the issue so that you can find the truth. The views and opinions expressed are his and do not represent the US Army, d o d, nor the US government. Dr. Sigoloff was either off duty or on approved leave and Dr.

Nurse Kelly: Sigoloff was not in uniform at the time of recording now to Dr. Sigoloff .

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: All right, well thank you for joining me again. I first wanna. Start off by saying thank you to all of my [00:01:00] Patreon supporters. I've got shell pace at the $50 level. At the 20 $20 level. I've got Sam and Angela Sheey at the pandemic reprimand level at $17 and 76.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: We have Ty, Charles Tin, Foyle Stanley, Dr. Anna, who is a guest on this show, Frank, and we have a new one. Brian. Thank you Brian. At the self-made $10 level, we have Kevin at the Refine Not Burned $5 tier. There's Linda Emmy, Joe Patton, Bev, pj, Rebecca, Marcus, Elizabeth, Dawn, Jennifer, and at the courageous contagious $1 level.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Amanda j Spits, nasty Drell. Susan BB King, who is a guest on this show. And Rick, thank you so much for all of your support. I greatly appreciate any monetary support, any prayers, any donations that the gifts, and go. Today I have a very special guest, Dr. Paul Burn. Dr. Paul Byrne is a pioneer in neonatology.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: He helped develop. The ventilation system for when we intubate children. He helped develop that, that we're still using today in 1963 is when he helped develop that. Sir, thank you [00:02:00] so much for coming on with us.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Thank you for inviting me. It, it's honor to be with you and yes I was instrumental in helping develop the ventilator, but the, the other thing I did that can be of interest to to you and your listeners is that I, I worked with the engineers from the astronaut program and we, we took the the blood pressure cuff from the finger of the astronaut and moved it up to the arm, the premature, and we were the ones that invented a method to take blood pressure on premature babies.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And so I started in 63. I would say that we didn't really make good progress until about 1970 when I started in 63. Every baby, three pounds and four ounces that had trouble with. With breathing died, it was a hundred percent [00:03:00] mortality. And, and of course now many auto, many of those babies now survive the ventilator's.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Interesting because it had to be very precise and very sensitive to function on the two pound baby. So once it was invented for the two pound baby it was shown to be effective at really at all ages and stages of eventually or so. Able to help people who who, who get in touch with me that have difficulties with breathing and the ventilator and the like, and it's it's almost like my the back of my hand that that I have a grasp on that use of the ventilator.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Anyway, it was it, it was a, a time when I wasn't the only one. Obviously there were multiple people in the world realizing how important it was to de develop ways to treat prematurely born babies. [00:04:00] So we started at Cardinal Glennon Hospital. The significant is, is that we were the ones that, that identified the need in parental nutrition for babies, the need for magnesium, the need for zinc and and, and so and the need for copper.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So those those elements are in the in, in parental nutrition really at all ages and stages. But if you can imagine that what would, what it was like to ha have tiny little babies and measure every bit of intake and output and, and every bit of urine, every bit of stool.

Dr. Paul Byrne: But we, we did all that in, in the Development of the care of premature babies. And then what happened in my life is that Joseph was born and he came under my care. His mother always insisted that he could not have been any more than 20 [00:05:00] weeks gestation. He was on, on a ventilator for several weeks.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And he wouldn't do anything. He wouldn't move when we would try to stimulate him. He wouldn't attempt to breathe at all. And so a brainwave test was done and they. Brainwave. The e EEG was interpreted as consistent with cerebral death. So that, that's what's written on his chart. So I asked the neurologist yeah, what is this?

Dr. Paul Byrne: Death on, on Joseph's chart. Obviously D Joseph was not dead. And he said, well, just get another one. And we did in two days. It was unchanged from the previous one. So now I ask him, well, what do we do now? He said, well, in some places they turn off the ventilator. I said, well, I don't do that. I said, I treat babies.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Some live, some die. I continue to treat Joseph. He did get off the ventilator. Later when he went to school, he got good grades. He ran track, he played [00:06:00] baseball. Eventually he married, but because of Joseph. I, I began to investigate this matter of brain death. Now, I have to tell you that I didn't start immediately, but by the time Joseph got to be a few months old and at home and e even though his EEGs were always so so terrible, I had a hard time even looking at them because they they were so abnormal, but he was doing okay.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So, so we continued to treat him, but then it was a matter of what is this thing about brain death? And I think that those In the medical field, or at least the objective medical field that had been paying attention to what's gone going on with Covid. It was in some ways a similar kind of thing as to what would, how it happened [00:07:00] with brain death.

Dr. Paul Byrne: The, the same as Covid came along, and then there were a lot of people saying we should do things. Well, what happened in brain death is that the, they did a heart transplant in South Africa. Dr. Christian Bernard did a heart transplant December the first, 1967. And there was a lot of notoriety throughout the world.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Heart transplant done successfully. Well, how about the second heart transplant? It was done three days later in Brooklyn, New York. And what they did is they cut the beating heart out of a three day old baby who had a problem with his brain and transplanted it into an 18 day old baby who had a problem with his heart.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And at the end of those procedures, both babies were dead and, and it was illegal. It was immoral. And so how did they solve the problem? They set up a, a [00:08:00] committee at Harvard. You know, they, they solved the problem with the committee. They, they didn't do, like, sometimes we would think that happens in medicine, that there's some investigation done on dogs or cats or rats or whatever.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And then information gathered on a few number of patients. What they did is they set up a committee and the committee invented brain death. They titled the article in the Journal of the American Medical Association, a definition of irreversible, irreversible coma. We can't. But when you're in coma, you're not dead.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and yet that's, that's how it started. And then they said, well why did they have to have this? And they said, well, if they don't have it, they won't be able to get organs for transplantation. And, and they wrote that in there. They also said that they if you continue to treat patients, the intensive [00:09:00] care units will get crowded.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and of course I can tell you, I know something about intensive care units getting crowded in the sense that when I started at Cardinal Glennon Children's Hospital, I had an eight, eight bed unit. And by the time I left there, about 20 years later, we had a 55 bed unit. So that when we got more patients to take care of, we found more ways to take care of them when we get.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Got the first ventilator functioning. We then had to get the second one also, and we did like that and worked that way. But what that, that the Harvard Committee said they had to have this so especially to get organs for transplantation. Well, if you look at that article in the Journal of the American Medical Association, 1968, they didn't do any studies on dogs or cats [00:10:00] or rats.

Dr. Paul Byrne: They didn't collect any patient data. They have only one reference to it. And that reference was to an allocution by Pope Pius Iih. And they quoted only one part of Pope Pi Pius Iih. But they ignored the the paragraph that said that that pop said We are to pr presume that human life continues as long as vital functions are present, even when supported by artificial means.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and so that was the only reference. But then they went on and, and started to use this thing for brain death to get organs. And that was in 68. And the next significant article that was published was in 1971, and it became known as the Minnesota Criteria. And, and if you look at that article and you, you look at it, it says a study of 25 patients, and [00:11:00] then you go r read it, and they did e, e, g on only nine.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Nine of the 25. So it really wasn't a study on 25. It was a study on nine. And then if you look at that, two of the nine still had e EEG activity. And then the conclusion of the article was no longer is it required to do brainwave testing before you make a declaration of brain death. Then with, with that E U G was essentially stricken it.

Dr. Paul Byrne: It still gets done a lot of times. But there the requirement of it certainly is not there in the Minnesota criteria, and it really wasn't there in the Harvard criteria either. And so many people think that brain death means flat brainwaves when in fact they aren't even required to do brainwave testing.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And so, so you see up until now, we, we don't have basic science studies. We, we, we don't ha have studies on [00:12:00] patients that would be acceptable for a, any other kind of scientific advancement. So then the largest study that's in the literature was was done and it was a report on 500 patients. And of those five, 500, the first thing is that 44 of them did not die.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And then those who did, did die they did autopsy on the brain in about half of them, 225 and 10% had no pathology in the brain. Now. And so that's the science behind brain death. There is no science that's, that would be acceptable, but you see what, what it is while they're, they're and we heard a lot of in the covid thing about data and science and all that stuff in some ways when I would hear those things, I knew what happened in brain death.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And it was very [00:13:00] similar that, that they, they claim science, but it really wasn't science. I'm not even sure it was pseudoscience in brain death. And they ju just invented it to get organs for for transplantation. And then when you talk about, you know, get getting organs for transplantation, and incidentally, there's really no science that in brain death that's of significance except what I've just told you.

Dr. Paul Byrne: But when, you know, talk about organs for transplantation they have to be healthy organs and people know what a cadaver is. And you don't have to be a super genius to know you probably aren't going to get much for transplantation from a cadaver from a dead body. And what happens in.

Dr. Paul Byrne: In the life of all of us, we we get that first driver's license and then we continue to [00:14:00] get the driver's license re, re renewed. And they asked the question, do you want to be an organ donor? And when I gave, gave a talk a few years a few weeks ago one of the young men 15 years old says, well in driver's ed, I had somebody come in and tell us the, the, the advance, the the the use of organ transplants and the benefits of organ transplants.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Well, they didn't tell anybody that they didn't tell them. And when people ask that question, they're not given any information about organ transplantation. But every organ that's translated. Is a healthy organ. And where do you get healthy organs? You get them from living persons. And, and and so when people say yes to being an organ donor, they have no idea.

Dr. Paul Byrne: They they, they have some idea that says, well, if I'm dead, so what, take my organs, that [00:15:00] kind of thing. And those kind of thoughts are there, but then it is important and it's essential that they learn what this is all about. And every time a heart transplant is done the the procedure begins, the chest is is open.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Not unlike every kind of heart heart operation that they do, but the chest is wide open. They do what's necessary to identify the blood vessels and to get them prepared to put them in some someone else. And then the transplant surgeon stops the beating heart. The transplant surgeon then cuts out that heart was just beating and puts it into someone else.

Dr. Paul Byrne: There's no way you can get a heart for transplant unless this is what happens to the donor. The donor has has to be killed. It has to be murder cuz it's not legal and yet it's accepted [00:16:00] to be done and so certainly unpaired vital organs like the heart or the whole liver. There's no way to get those organs unless they get them from a living person.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and when you get into organ transplants, they do talk about living donors, but they don't do them quite so much as they used to where they take. A a kidney one of two kidneys, or they take a part of the liver and transplanted o ob obviously any of us that know anything about the operations on the abdomen and the liver and what, how what it's like, know that it's not a, a simple procedure to to get that liver out and then transplant part of it to someone else.

Dr. Paul Byrne: But all, all of these things have to do with organ transplantation and they, the people have to know that there's essentially [00:17:00] no way that you can get an organ for transplantation from a cadaver. And the large maj majority of organs for transplantation come after the declaration of brain death.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Well, what's the decoration of brain death all about? Well, it's it's basically amounts to looking at three parts of the brain that is, whether the person doesn't respond is one of the ways and no response. They say it means coma, but. That's really not me. What it means, it means no response.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And then they call it unconscious, but it's not necessarily a lack of consciousness. It's a lack of response. And then they do they look at brainstem reflexes and they brainstem reflexes that they look out. Lookout are primarily those that have to do with the eye, the ear, the cough, [00:18:00] the gag.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So they, the, they shine a light light in the eye to see if the pupil responds. They check for a blink. They put ice water in the ear to see if there's movement of the eye, and then check for cough or dag so that they. Evaluate five or six of the 14 brainstem reflexes. And then the the third part of declaration of brain death ha has to do with what is called an apnea test, but it's not.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Simply a test. It's a procedure, a test. You know, if if we're gonna get a blood test, we go in and some somebody they put a tonic on her arm and take the blood for test. If we're gonna get a chest x-ray, we go to a place where they do chest x-rays. We we put our shoulders up. They say, take a deep breath and hold it.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And then they make the image. So it's, it's all [00:19:00] done in a very simple way. But that's not what happens in the in the apnea test. It's a procedure where they take a patient who is on a ventilator, their life is being supported by a ventilator and. They, they do things like make sure about that.

Dr. Paul Byrne: They get high amounts of oxygen. They do blood gases. They take away the ventilator. They make observations on the patient and, and and they take away the ventilator for 10 minutes. The patient's on the ventilator getting a breath every five seconds, seconds or so, 20 times a minute, and they take it away.

Dr. Paul Byrne: They take it away and, and then wa watch the patient and they sometimes the their blood pressure will go down. Sometimes their the, the heart will even stop. And they the apnea test [00:20:00] is a test where even if they, they, they do things like give extra oxygen. What happens in the apnea test?

Dr. Paul Byrne: They, they. Accumulate carbon dioxide. So the carbon dioxide goes up. It doesn't go up in a little bit. Normally healthy people, they keep their carbon dioxide pretty much be, be between 25 and 45 at the very most. That kind of thing, the extremes of it. I, I, I should say 35 to 45, you know plus or minus five from 40.

Dr. Paul Byrne: What do they do in the procedure of the apnea test? They make, they, the carbon dioxide go to 60. Go to 60 and, and they, they and e everybody who knows much about intracranial pressure knows that if you hyperventilate, you give extra breasts, the carbon, the [00:21:00] intracranial pressure goes down. When the carbon dioxide increases, who would think that the intracranial pressure would do anything except go up?

Dr. Paul Byrne: And if you're already in Al Al already dealing with a patient that has something wrong with the brain, the question is, will that stimulus have the same effect as it would be if somebody was healthy? And, and then why would they want to do this? And the current patient then that, that, that I'm helping and is, is, is a a, a young man who overdosed on alcohol and was treated in an emergency room well with a ventilator for 24 hours, and then was sent home.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Whoever heard of doing such a thing sent, sent him home after getting off the ventilator in, in 24 hours. And what do you think happened at home In about another 24 hours, he quit breathing again. So then he, [00:22:00] he gets in the system and, and you have, have to know that his organs are worth between one and $5 million to the transplant industry.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and and of course they have designated requesters who get get the permission to to take the organs and and, and and so all of that falls into place and they said, well, they never asked for organs and until they do that procedure of the apnea test or the evaluation for.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Brain death, but everybody on the team knows what all of that's all about, no matter what anybody is saying to the relatives or not saying to to the relatives. And so what happened with this with, with this boy, is they, they did their evaluation for for brain death. And it include, [00:23:00] put ice water in the air.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Incidentally I'm a, a swimmer, so get water in my ear every now and then. And when it goes in there, even ordinary swimming pool water feels very cold under those circumstances. So you can just about imagine what putting ice water in the areas. Well, what happened was this boy had some movement of his eye.

Dr. Paul Byrne: One of the doctors saw a nystagmus, and, and so when do I get involved? When they want to do another test for evaluating brain brain function when in fact he, he was just critically ill and, and he needs to get treated. He doesn't need another test. And so what does the Academy of Neurology say?

Dr. Paul Byrne: Well, if you get a, any kind of response, it's okay to do another one. And so the, the, the test gets repeated until eventually they don't get a response, and then they [00:24:00] can declare somebody brain dead. Everybody who's declared brain dead is a living person. Brain death has nothing to do with, with death. In fact, the matter is it's brainwashing.

Dr. Paul Byrne: You give somebody two nouns like brain and like death, and the mind goes toward the more serious, the more critical kind of thing. And so brain, brain death is is brainwashing. Everybody who's called Brain Dead has a. Beating heart circulation re respiration. They digest food. They put out urine.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And actually a study at Johns Hopkins University in 10 patients with the declaration of Brain death in all 10 of them when they cut them to take take their heart for transplant and all 10 of them, the heart rate went up and the blood pressure went up. Now, would that happen in a cadaver?

Dr. Paul Byrne: No way. And so these things are going on. [00:25:00] It's it's big business. The it, it's big business. And and, and 48 billion was billed in 2020 for organ transplants, of which $6 billion went to doctors. Do you have any thoughts or questions?[00:26:00]

Dr. Paul Byrne: That, that's it, it is. And and all, all of those things that, that sorry about that. That all of those things that you and I have said are, are accurate and and the people need to know about him, but how do they find out about it? And then just speaking of your, your of, of your own self if, if you said [00:27:00] yes on your ever, that's, is on your record.

Dr. Paul Byrne: You can go back and, and And get it taken off or not put it on the next time. But the studies have shown that unless you have a document of refusal, they can still find that out someplace and say, well, at one time he wanted to give organs. And obviously in, in the condition he's in those around him can speak for him.

Dr. Paul Byrne: He's a a kind person, a generous person, and, and and, and so under these circumstances, because he already said he, he that kind of thing. And that's what, what what what goes on. And so incidentally, the laws that are involved here are the Uniform determination of Death Act in the Uniform Anatomical Gift Act, and the.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Uniform Anatomical Gift Act spells out that, that if you don't want to be an organ donor, [00:28:00] you have to have a document of refusal. And there are very few places that give you a way to have a document of, of refusal. We do send out Cards when we're contacted at life guardian foundation.org we ha we have cards that, that people can sign.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and they're, they're very important because they, they sign them and they, they say, what's the first thing it says? It says, I wanna be treated and then I want everything done to protect and preserve my life. And don't do anything to hasen my death or shorten my life and don't do an apnea test.

Dr. Paul Byrne: That apnea test that I told you about, it's an awful test. No one should ever have an apnea test and everybody needs to know, say, no, no, no to the apnea test. Everybody has to know that. And so, so, and, and no to organ transplantation. [00:29:00] Then the card also GI gives away that you can designate someone to speak for you and, and designate the first person to second person.

Dr. Paul Byrne: But that is, is is so important, Sam, because e everybody who gets to the age of majority, which in most places is 18 before that they look to the parents for for permission to do things and not in like the young boy that I'm telling you told you about, they look to the parents, but then once they get to be 18, that's not what happens.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So the patients that I deal with sometimes the mother will be in Texas. The young man, 19 years old gets in, in, involved in an accident in California, and by the time she gets there, they've already gone to court. To get someone to speak for that boy. And, and, and it, it's re really something [00:30:00] what happens in the legal system of, of this Miranda Lawson in Virginia, a two year old girl who choked on popcorn and, and she had six siblings, but in the court they would not allow her mother or her father noon because obviously there must be something wrong with the mother and father lets her two year old child choke on popcorn and one wouldn't let any of the brothers or sisters brothers or sister to to Desi be the guardian to designate to speak for her.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So what did the court do? The court appointed and. An attorney, you, a 30 year old nice lady. But in, in the courtroom, the judge would look for her about making making decisions for man Miranda, not her father who was there and not her brothers or sister who was there. And when that happens you it, it's, it's just shuttering to see [00:31:00] what the system is.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So you have to learn about the system. We've learned a lot about the the system with Covid and we, we keep learning it. Because, and. And they basically showed that they can control us by making us all stay in our house for a, a period of time. But also they, they did things like, like hasten the production of that in injection and did not do studies to safeguard the used use of it and then mandated that some places they had to get that.

Dr. Paul Byrne: I mean I, I go to the For cardiac rehab, they wouldn't let me go in for cardiac rehab during that time. And then and so I get taken off the list and eventually when they start to lift things, they say, well, you don't qualify anymore. And cuz they have another rule. And then eventually I get back in [00:32:00] and, and and you have to wear a mask to go in.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Well, it isn't too long that you look around in the. People on the exercise machine don't have the mask on. The nurse will have it on in such a way that it's her nose is exposed that kind of thing. And then you go in one day and says You don't need a mask anymore. And that goes on for a month or two months or whatever it is.

Dr. Paul Byrne: You go in one day and now you need a mask again. And then when I, even now, even though we don't wear the mask anymore, I, I go past the water fountain and it has a big sign on it saying don't drink this for whatever way. And it all comes from Covid. They haven't taken the sign down yet, you know, and that's in the, and of course the medi medical system.

Dr. Paul Byrne: We learned a lot about it from the covid, but I already know a lot about it because I've been following these things about [00:33:00] brain death and or organ transplants and for a, a number of years. And And the desires of human beings sometimes are the ones that that take effect. And then they, they do things like, like in 19 68, 19 70, when that was going on, where were the doctors?

Dr. Paul Byrne: And of course, I can ask that same question because I was a doctor at that time. But what was I doing? I was trying to find better ways to take care of babies. And, and I trusted the neurologist. I thought the neurologist would be good doctors and would, but and then when I started to study in 1975, I found out the neurologist and the doctors who were involved, and they all weren't neurologists, but the doctors who were n.

Dr. Paul Byrne: In involved didn't do their job. And it wasn't just a neurologist who didn't do their job, [00:34:00] the theologian didn't do their job, and the neurologist and theologians still don't do their job. And, and and you know, cuz their, the first thing that they should be doing is protecting and preserving the life of the person.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And the theologian is the same way, should be tuned into protecting and preserving the life of that person. But, Where, where are they? Yes, there are some of us that are doing our best, but but we are not chairman of departments. We're not governors, we're not presidents. We're not senators. And, and and, and then they, while they did the thing with with with the medical world and in, in brain death, they took over the medical world by getting doctors to accept that someone was dead while their heart was beating and they had circulation respiration [00:35:00] digest food, put out urine.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Somebody's they were dead. It was dumb. It was stupid. And what did the doctors do? They accepted it. And what do they do now? They still accept it. They, they accept it. And so the doctors are there. Where, where are the doctors? Where are the theologians? And then what happens? The law gets involved. And then what happens?

Dr. Paul Byrne: The legislators get involved. And, and, and these things con continue. A a, a patient in Nevada, Aiden Hallu a 20 year old girl who developed abdominal pain, goes to the emergency room and they decide that she might have appendicitis. So they do exploratory laparotomy. They don't find appendicitis, they don't find anything.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and she never woke up. She never woke up. Was nothing wrong with her. She never woke [00:36:00] up. Her father was clever enough that when he got on on the scene, he immediately went to court and got to be the guardian. If, if he hadn't done that who knows what would happen, but he did it. So he was the guardian.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And then they and Mark on the the declaration of brain death. And, and what happened? They did e e g recording three times on her and every time she had e e g activity. But then, They decide, decided that that wasn't relevant and they could declare her brain dead anyway. And, and, and so, so yes, we get involved and yes, it does get appealed to the Supreme Court in Nevada.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And yes, it was a seven to nothing unanimous Supreme Court ruling that they couldn't be convinced that it was the Academy of Neurology guidelines versus the[00:37:00] Harvard criteria or some other thing. They sent it back to the lower court. Well, Before the lower court could get involved again, Aiden, Hulu did die.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and and so then what happened in Nevada, the legislators got involved and made it. So the things that were in, in question with Aiden Hulu won't happen again. They made it so you don't have to ask the relatives to get permission to do that apnea test. They, they made it so that the only criteria are the Academy of Neurology guidelines, which to point out some of them, they don't require that you do test for hypothalamus.

Dr. Paul Byrne: They they say if there is this thing called some reaction, you just can do it again. And they, they don't tell you that. They, they just say it can be repeated. And so and then in Nevada, they put into the law that if any of the relatives [00:38:00] bring up questions about this, the, the relatives may be responsible for all medical and legal financial.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Consequences of that. And so they made it. So the system is that you, you cannot speak up. And, and there's an attempt to get these kinds of things for all states. They, the u Uniform Law Commission in Chicago has been looking at these the, these things that have happened in the court and they want to revise the Uniform Determination of Death Act.

Dr. Paul Byrne: The uniform determination of death ought not be revised. It should be repealed, and it should be replaced with a law that will protect and preserve the life of the person. So what do they want to want to do with the law? The first thing about the Brain death law, it, it now the Uniform Determination of Death Act, it says, [00:39:00] Irreversible cessation of all functions of the entire brain, including the brainstem.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So what do they wanna make that from? They just wanna make it, that it, it's a coma, not those brainstem reflexes. And, and that Apnea test and that's all. And, but you see the, the, the people think that it is the current law cessation of all functions of the entire brain, including the brainstem, when in fact it's not.

Dr. Paul Byrne: That's how we were able to do something with the cases with Aidan Ou and Israel Stinson and Aria Cha Gabardi and, and point out, while the law says cessation of all functions of the entire brain, they don't evaluate mu much less anything whether they know that all functions. So pointing that out.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So now what do they want to do? They wanna revise the law so that the only functions that are relevant [00:40:00] are those three that I just told you about. And then what's in the law now is it says irreversible cessation and they want to change irreversible to. Permanent and what permanent means that, that they don't do anything to change it.

Dr. Paul Byrne: If somebody stops breathing or their heart stops, they deliberately do not resuscitate. And that, that's what permanent means versus irreversible. Irreversible is a misleading word in itself because you really only know irreversible in relation to the rev reverse, the reversible, the, when it is reversible, it's that kind of thing.

Dr. Paul Byrne: It's not empiric, you know US doctors, we can observe an absence of function. We can observe des de destruction, but we cannot observe irreversibility we can learn some things about it. [00:41:00] But you see, it's, it's, again, brainwashing because the way it works is what, when somebody is dead, when death has occurred, the brain doesn't, the brain is destroyed and.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And lots of things are destroyed and they don't function and they won't ever function again. But if you go the other way and observe only the absence of function, the absence of the response of pupil in the eye are whatever tests that you do, you observe. Only that they don't even know if the brain is destroyed, much less that the person is dead.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So they, they, these kinds of things are already deficiencies in the law. And incidentally, we have written about those. We have an article in a journal of the American Medical Association. We we have an article in the Gonzaga Law Review that's 85 pages, has 244 footnotes and references to it. So we.

Dr. Paul Byrne: We, we [00:42:00] have done all that. And who knows who pays attention to us? And it, it, it's important, but for right now, it's important that you and I talk to each other and the listeners out there must learn that brain death is not death. Brain death means you're alive. And, and what can you do about it? The first thing you have to do is protect yourself and, and and say no to the apnea.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Test. Protect yourself and get a document of refusal and know that at the license Bureau you, you Yeah, you, you say no to that and then you not need to know how they're changing the law and making it worse making it even less strict. Is there something as, is there a law that would protect the life of the person?

Dr. Paul Byrne: And I would say yes. We have a model's statute. The, [00:43:00] the first thing is this, the, the statute is written in the negative. It, it says, no one shall be declared dead unless there is destruction of the circulatory and respiratory systems and the entire brain. And actually, I really think instead of entire brain, it should be nervous system.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Now, why system that. The basic unit of biology is the cell and groups of cells make up tissues and groups of cells and tissues make up organs and and groups of organs and tissues put together to carry out function. Those are called systems. There are three vital systems. The circulatory system, the respiratory system, and the brain and all, all of them are necessary.

Dr. Paul Byrne: We can substitute for one or the other, but when you put the law to protect the person, you put it in the negative and say, no one shall be declared [00:44:00] dead unless there's destruction of the circulatory and respiratory systems and the entire brain that will protect. The life of the person. And if, if you, if we go back to protecting the life of the person, which is what it was when I learned medicine.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And it is it, it is in lots of places in the world but in the laws in the United States, in the medical system that life is not being protected and it's not being protected for who knows what reason. But I can tell you that it's a big. Business. The organ transplant business is a big business.

Dr. Paul Byrne: 48 billion was billed in 2020, of which 6 billion went to doctors and doctors or such. You know, you know, they do things in this organ taking things. They said, well, the doctor who's treating [00:45:00] can't, can't have anything to do with organ transplantation. How stupid that is. Does somebody think that doctors, who are the treating doctors as opposed to the doctors who take organs, that they don't have coffee together?

Dr. Paul Byrne: That they don't play golf together? I mean, what, what is this that they've put things in to I suppose to think that you can fool the people. But the fact of the matter is there's a lot of people that, that can understand the difference between life and death. And you can take a seven year old and take them into an intensive care unit where somebody's on a ventilator, they have normal color of their skin, and they can see on the aScope above the he head, I guess they don't call it a psdo scope anymore, but on the scope, scope above their head you can see beep, beep, beep.

Dr. Paul Byrne: The nurse comes in and takes blood pressure. They can look at the the, the urine collecting in the bag [00:46:00] and, and ask them, is that alive or dead? And any seven year old can tell the difference. And yet we live in a system where they play, pretend, and they're willing to play, pretend so they can get what's immediate like organs for transplant.

Dr. Paul Byrne: I really think if they hadn't gone this route of getting of, of taking organs from people who weren't dead, an artificial heart would have been invented already. It would've been invented. It's been, there's been some that ha have been used for short periods of time, but there's the, the need for an artificial heart isn't there when you can get a heart from somebody who's not dead.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And there are some things that are interesting Sam, about those that heart or the liver or whatever it is the it's identified. Each one of us has [00:47:00] d n A and our dna N is specific and it identifies every cell of our body. It identifies every organ of our body. And incidentally, that d n a that we used to, I identi that to ha have that kind of a biochemical I identity of ourself that's there in the first cell.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Already at conception that that that person can be identified. And then at conception, nothing is a added. They, the, there's cell division, there's now growth and development. All that happens without e, you know, even before implantation. So it's built in already there at conception in the first cell.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And that d n a that's there at ud, an unrepeatable in each and every one of us that's in the [00:48:00] heart, that's taken for transplantation. And when that heart is taken for transplantation and that heart belongs to that person, if you would just put it in another person, it would be rejected because our, our bodies are ma made so that we reject organs from other people.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And so there's much done to make for anti-rejection things and the recipients of the organs. And I'll get more to that, but I want to talk about the DNA n a of that heart, that that identifies the heart from the patient that they take it from. That never changes. And the recipient, it's still the d n a of the re of the one that they took it from in, in that heart.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And so the identity is, is, is still there? They, they I, I, I lost one train of thought there [00:49:00] because I got off into this one. It's when, when you try to do too many things at one time it's not always good, especially for us men. I, I think women learned how to do more things at, at the same time than we we do.

Dr. Paul Byrne: But in any event the, the, I go ahead.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: You were gonna mention oh, is it the the de the rejection medications,

Dr. Paul Byrne: Oh, yes. Oh, oh. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. The re, re re rejection, you see our body is made to reject the organ from anybody else cannot do that, except God does it all the time.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Every time a mother is pregnant, she does not reject her baby. The rejection medicine is the the rejection is interfered with in pregnancy. God stops it during pregnancy, and then as soon as the baby is [00:50:00] delivered, her mother's immune mechanisms were right back there. Now, many people I can identify how immune mechanisms are different during pregnancy and, and that ki kind of thing.

Dr. Paul Byrne: So you have to be careful with the as careful as the lady who's pregnant to not get exposed to different things. And because the immune mechanisms are different and that gets interfered with incidentally, The, the, the, there's a early pregnancy factor that can be identified already when there's just two cells to and so that anti that interference with the rejection is probably there right away.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, and studies have been done in human beings and, and to identify an early pregnancy factor to identify that the that, that the mother's pregnant, that there's a baby there, al already ear early [00:51:00] on even before implantation. So, and and, and some of those things. There, there are some other things that are in, in interesting that get involved, that, that come out of the transplant industry.

Dr. Paul Byrne: One of the things is, is that when a mother is pregnant, some of the baby's cells get into the mother, and that, that, that's called chimerism in that. Ca came out of the transplant industry because they would make a slice of the liver of a of a, a, a woman who had carried a boy baby. And periodically you could see male cells.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And the male cells have been found in multiple places in the body. Nobody knows what they do. Female cells are also identified, but the they are, are not so easily distinguished as they are a male cell [00:52:00] in, in terms of the the mother's female body kind of thing. But it comes out of that and, and, and more and more things come out of it in, in, in science.

Dr. Paul Byrne: What what we really do is verify what God has already done. That's what good science does. And, and yes doctors ha ha, ha have to be scientists, but we also have to have an art to medicine and we all, we need to identify with the specialness of the gifts of a physician. That, that we get intelligence and we and, and we study and, and then we have the privilege of helping somebody who is, is sick and, and we, we aren't simply scientists, but where the science is used, it has to be good science.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And, [00:53:00] and and, and many times the science in medicine is wanting to, to basically start with, because each person is unique and unrepeatable. We're not like gun rats where they all look exactly alike and you can do tests on them. Each person is different. So, so the scientific setup is not, not good.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And then when you bypass whatever it is that we try to do to protect the person, like they did with, with the the covid injection, it's it's just shameful how whatever science there is in medicine may they get around it to to make happen what they want to make happen. And, and, and what did I get today?

Dr. Paul Byrne: And and article about Gardasil, Gardasil and the Covid vaccine and how it's altering the essentially the immune mechanisms in other parts of, [00:54:00] of cellular makeup. And, and and, and you know, the gardas is. Been been around for a while now, and they, they it, it, it's an immunization against against human papillomavirus, and it's just shameful.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And they give it to, to all the young people, and they don't teach them. You know it, it, you know, sexual activity is between a man and a woman, and ideally after they're married. And if it's just between one man and one woman, there's no disease, none. You don't need an an immunization. You just need to know what the truth is and then live according to that.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Now, I don't wanna sound like a goody good cuz not that but, but I do want to say that we have an obligation to under, to find the truth and stand for it and educate the other [00:55:00] people and. And we can't get along with things so easily as the ordinary person. So in any, in any event brain death is not death.

Dr. Paul Byrne: There is a difference between life and death. In during life. There's living substance, and the living substance is a unity of the physical and spiritual. And the event at the end of life is called death. And then, which have left after that are the dead remains. The remains without the life, the remains without.

Dr. Paul Byrne: The soul and that remains, gets manifest as destruction, disintegration, corruption, but it's cl clearly different. And, and when somebody is, is ha having circulation and respiration and digesting food to say their dead is stupid. [00:56:00] And so, so, and. How they did it, I'm not sure. It doesn't make any sense to me.

Dr. Paul Byrne: I was a doctor in 68. I didn't start until 75 to get interested, and then it took me about two years to understand the language such that I could at least de discuss it. And so I, I wouldn't try to imply that everything is is so easy, but the problem that we have is that, that the big money. Is in organ transplants and people see somebody who has received a heart or a kidney or a liver or whatever it is, and they're doing well, so they think everything is okay.

Dr. Paul Byrne: They don't realize that, that when someone gets an organ for transplantation, they exchange one set of problems for another set of, of problems when, when [00:57:00] in fact, like if you just take kidney transplant and I don't want to take anything against say anything against what, how sick somebody is or what they need.

Dr. Paul Byrne: But one of my friends who got sick and got dialysis and he went, went there and had another man ask him, were you new here? And, and anyway, the man said he had been. On dialysis for 35 years. Another one said for 40 years. So it, it, it isn't that, that there aren't things that can be done. And if you go the moral way, at least in my own experience, by doing what I've done in the development of neo neonatology and ways to to treat infants.

Dr. Paul Byrne: If you go the moral way, you make. Progress much faster than if you go the immoral way. And so I, I would encourage that, that people learn the truth and know the truth, stand for the truth, [00:58:00] and, and they, they model statute that I told you about, that's what the, the Uniformed Law Commission should do.

Dr. Paul Byrne: They should reject the Uniform determination of Death Act and they should get the model statute that says no one shall be declared dead unless there is destruction of the circulatory and respiratory systems and the entire brain. And that's the direction we should go in. Sam, do you have any comments, questions?

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Well, I'm just standing here in shock from still from when you gave the, the story of Joseph, and that was in 1975. So he potentially has grandchildren now. That would not be here his whole entire lineage. You know, I would not be here if you, let's say if he would've been entered into that heart study and his heart would've take been taken out and given to some other little boy.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Absolutely. And and, and and [00:59:00] so, so it's that, that kind of thing. And we can look back on things and put them together as you've just done there. But really we have to make decisions in terms of what we have today. And, and yes, we do know a lot more about life and we do know a lot more about supporting life and, and.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And and so to say that when somebody can't defend themselves, it's all right to call them dead while they still have a beating heart circulation. That's wrong. And we have serious things going on in our society. And, and so all of us have to pray a lot, do the very best we can in terms of our own our own lives, our own family, our own friends, our own neighbors, our own people who listen to this program.[01:00:00]

Dr. Paul Byrne: They, they need to know that brain death is not death. Brain death is a lie. It's a lie to get. Organs for transplantation. And of course they'll say, oh, no, no, it's not for that at all. It's, it's because of whatever they'll come up with. The, the, the main reason that they declare brain death is to get organs for transplantation.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And I don't mean to sound unconcerned about somebody who's very sick with a failing liver or failing heart or whatever it is. I'm concerned about them too. But I want to have a way to develop treatments that protect and preserve life and don't take advantage of the unresponsive person on a ventilator.

Dr. Paul Byrne: How shameful this 15 year old boy I'm telling you about how shameful to be to be trying to declare him dead when in fact, They should be doing everything they can to help him and the [01:01:00] doctors know what to do. But you see, the driving force is to get organs so they, they quickly stop doing what they know to do so they can get organs for transplantation.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: What we've seen in, in our history of this country is that they're after dis their, our fight is not against flesh and blood, but against rulers and principalities of darkness in the unseen realm, and that they're trying to destroy our future by, with abortion, they, they've been trying to destroy the current future that the children who are alive now with this transgender movement, they've been destroying the, the elder population with this covid movement and now this, this battle of, of killing people and taking their organs and giving them people that, that need them.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: This has been going on for such a long time and I had no idea that this was going on. And I want to thank you so much for bringing this to light cuz this is so supremely important for, for the layperson to understand, like, don't ever do an apnea test that would kill anybody, that would cause significant issues for anybody.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: If you were in that [01:02:00] situation, if you were paralyzed, unable to breathe in, they'd just turn your vent off. I mean, it just, that's what it is. They're just turning your vent off like you're injured. We as the medical community are supposed to be here to help. Preserve life, but yet we're keep taking it time and time again.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: And every time we go deeper into this little rabbit hole of protecting life, it seems like we're not doing that. We're doing the exact opposite.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Incidentally, brain death is not about stopping a ventilator. It's about continuing it until it's more convenient to get the to get the recipient of the organ recipient lined up.

Dr. Paul Byrne: And so they declare them dead, but then they keep, keep them on the ventilator until they can get everything lined up so that they can when they do take the organs, they can get them into somebody else quickly. So it's about, you know about continuing a ventilator, not stopping it.[01:03:00]

Dr. Paul Byrne: Yeah. Okay. Now the other thing, Sam, I. I hope that, I hope this helps you in in, in I, I surely hope that it doesn't cause you any grief. And if I can do anything to help other people or who knows, maybe you and I might talk again sometime.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Yes, sir. Thank you so much for coming on. I truly appreciate it.

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Thank you for your time,

Dr. Paul Byrne: Sam. Happy to know you. I'll send you that article. Thank you. I think I have your email address. I, I, I know I do. I I will send you that article that I just got today. I think it could be important for you. I didn't want to send it before the, our interview cuz I didn't want to make it look too much that it was the article I did mention the Gardasil, but I'll send you that.

Dr. Paul Byrne: Thank you. I get off here. All right. Take care.[01:04:00]

Dr. Sam Sigoloff: Just a reminder for everyone out there in duty, uniform of the day, the full armor of God. Let's all make courage more contagious than fear.

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